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twillight	Not just Moses can turn gold to dust...		Lead	[-]
Posts: 280 06/17/09 12:35:45	Tags : None ...but Hilkiah too. 23:4 And the king commanded Hilkiah the high priest, and the priests of the second order, and the keepers of the door, to bring forth out of the temple of the LORD all the vessels that were made for Baal, and for the grove, and for all the host of heaven: and he burned them without Jerusalem in the fields of Kidron, and carried the ashes of them unto Bethel. But if read carefully in this nation all "vessels" what were made to any gods, you'll know that they made of gold or silver, or - in the later time, when money was scarce - copper. Now turning metal to dust with heat - that's the technology!
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wickle		#1	[url]	[-]
Posts: 396 06/17/09 13:01:54	Vessel is also a euphemism for a person.
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twillight		#2	[url]	[-]
Posts: 282 06/17/09 13:37:13	According to the context I'm pretty sure it means pots and bowls. Besides when they kill/sacrifise people this part separatly meantions that.
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wickle		#3	[url]	[-]
Posts: 397 06/17/09 13:44:14	twillight wrote: According to the context I'm pretty sure it means pots and bowls. Besides when they kill/sacrifise people this part separatly meantions that. Smirk....just thought I`d try a Daystar move. Yea, it means pots and bowls, as far as I can tell.
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Argy Lacedom		#4	[url]	[-]
Posts: 2824 06/17/09 16:25:08	Smirk....just thought I`d try a Daystar move. That's weird. I get this vision of you bending over backwards and kissing your own arse. What the question boils down to is this... Is a thing good because god commands it or does god command it because it is good? If the former, then the believer must accept that god could make murdering children good. If the latter, then the believer must accept that we have no need of god for moral instruction.
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wickle		#5	[url]	[-]
Posts: 398 06/17/09 16:43:52	Argy Lacedom wrote: Smirk....just thought I`d try a Daystar move. That's weird. I get this vision of you bending over backwards and kissing your own arse. Weird yet, thats about what it felt like. Day means day , unless it means weeks or years. Evil is evil , unless god does it , then it means something else. God means elvis, or it could mean the Creator of The Universe. Dead sometimes doesn`t mean dead-dead.
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Daystar.pathwaymachine	Silver And Gold	#6	[url]	[-]
Posts: 820 06/19/09 10:59:42	It was crushed as was the typical action. Exodus 32:20 - Then he took the [Gold] calf that they had made and he burnt it with fire and crushed it till it was fine, after which he scattered it upon the surface of the waters and made the sons of Israel drink it.
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twillight	Daystar fails chemistry	#7	[url]	[-]
Posts: 287 06/19/09 11:31:01	Look, did you ever crushed metal, D.? It wont "turn to dust". You need a file or a grinder to turn metal to dust. Now as there wasn't electric-powered, not even steam-engined grinders that'd mean manual machines, what'd mean fuckin' slow process. Especially in the middle of a desert, where you won't have grinder.
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Daystar.pathwaymachine		#8	[url]	[-]
Posts: 823 06/19/09 13:31:32	twillight wrote: Look, did you ever crushed metal, D.? It wont "turn to dust". You need a file or a grinder to turn metal to dust. Now as there wasn't electric-powered, not even steam-engined grinders that'd mean manual machines, what'd mean fuckin' slow process. Especially in the middle of a desert, where you won't have grinder. How would you explain Deuteronomy 9:12 - "And your sin that YOU had made, the calf, I took, and I proceeded to burn it in the fire and to crush it, grinding it thoroughly until it had become fine like dust; after which I threw its dust into the torrent that was descending from the mountain." If it couldn't be done at the time how did they explain that it was being done?
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Matthew Ellard.pedg		#9	[url]	[-]
Posts: 693 06/21/09 16:25:50	Daystar wrote: twillight wrote: Look, did you ever crushed metal, D.? It wont "turn to dust". You need a file or a grinder to turn metal to dust. Now as there wasn't electric-powered, not even steam-engined grinders that'd mean manual machines, what'd mean fuckin' slow process. Especially in the middle of a desert, where you won't have grinder. How would you explain Deuteronomy 9:12 - "And your sin that YOU had made, the calf, I took, and I proceeded to burn it in the fire and to crush it, grinding it thoroughly until it had become fine like dust; after which I threw its dust into the torrent that was descending from the mountain." If it couldn't be done at the time how did they explain that it was being done? You may both be correct. You can make gold dust simply by rubbing gold with another stone however you need a steady flow of water to separate the heavier gold dust from other debris. The bottom line is that is it very improbable and it is only a myth so it is a waste of time trying to explain it.
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Daystar.pathwaymachine		#10	[url]	[-]
Posts: 848 06/21/09 16:35:27	Matthew Ellard wrote: Daystar wrote: twillight wrote: Look, did you ever crushed metal, D.? It wont "turn to dust". You need a file or a grinder to turn metal to dust. Now as there wasn't electric-powered, not even steam-engined grinders that'd mean manual machines, what'd mean fuckin' slow process. Especially in the middle of a desert, where you won't have grinder. How would you explain Deuteronomy 9:12 - "And your sin that YOU had made, the calf, I took, and I proceeded to burn it in the fire and to crush it, grinding it thoroughly until it had become fine like dust; after which I threw its dust into the torrent that was descending from the mountain." If it couldn't be done at the time how did they explain that it was being done? You may both be correct. You can make gold dust simply by rubbing gold with another stone however you need a steady flow of water to separate the heavier gold dust from other debris. The bottom line is that is it very improbable and it is only a myth so it is a waste of time trying to explain it. Numbers 31:22-23 - "Only the gold and the silver, the copper, the iron, the tin and the lead, everything that is processed with fire, you should pass through the fire, and it must be clean. Only it should be purified by the water for cleansing. And everything that is not processed with fire you should pass through the water." Of course, I don't think it is a myth.
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Matthew Ellard.pedg		#11	[url]	[-]
Posts: 694 06/21/09 18:42:45	Daystar wrote: Numbers 31:22-23 - "Only the gold and the silver, the copper, the iron, the tin and the lead, everything that is processed with fire, you should pass through the fire, and it must be clean. Only it should be purified by the water for cleansing. And everything that is not processed with fire you should pass through the water." Of course, I don't think it is a myth. I was thinking about "Jason & The Golden Fleece" because the early jews were sheep & goat formers. In essence, sheep fleeces are laid in the bottom of a small stream or artificial stream. Gold dust sinks to the fleece while lighter debris washes over the fleece. This is the method of extracting gold in turkey around 600BC and the origins of the "Golden Fleece" myth. (Jason went to Turkey) I was simply wondering if both myths had some common elements. They probably do not.....but hey....I'm allowed to wonder. I'm not sure how Moses would smelter iron without charcol considering we cannot find one charcoal pit or any other evidence that there was a population wandering around the desert. Making charcoal requires clay ( to de-oxygenate the wood) . This sort of defines where archeologists should be looking....but still ...nothing. That's 600,000 warriors and their families. not a trace.....not one hearth....human poo.....animal bone/waste pits...nothing.
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Daystar.pathwaymachine		#12	[url]	[-]
Posts: 849 06/22/09 07:08:30	Matthew wrote: I'm not sure how Moses would smelter iron without charcol considering we cannot find one charcoal pit or any other evidence that there was a population wandering around the desert. Making charcoal requires clay ( to de-oxygenate the wood) . This sort of defines where archeologists should be looking....but still ...nothing. That's 600,000 warriors and their families. not a trace.....not one hearth....human poo.....animal bone/waste pits...nothing. In ancient times charcoal was made by covering a pile of wood with earth and burning it slowly for several days with only a sufficient amount of air to burn off the gases, resulting in a relatively pure form of carbon. You are not, I take it, familiar with Dr. Nelson Glueck's work in the 1950's? He discovered a 150 mile stretch of the Exodus route in the late 50's. From Kadesh-barnea to Hormath, east of Beersheba. Nomadic peoples seldom leave much behind.
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Matthew Ellard.pedg		#13	[url]	[-]
Posts: 696 06/22/09 16:56:54	Daystar wrote: Matthew wrote: I'm not sure how Moses would smelter iron without charcol considering we cannot find one charcoal pit or any other evidence that there was a population wandering around the desert. Making charcoal requires clay ( to de-oxygenate the wood) . This sort of defines where archeologists should be looking....but still ...nothing. That's 600,000 warriors and their families. not a trace.....not one hearth....human poo.....animal bone/waste pits...nothing. In ancient times charcoal was made by covering a pile of wood with earth and burning it slowly for several days with only a sufficient amount of air to burn off the gases, resulting in a relatively pure form of carbon. You are not, I take it, familiar with Dr. Nelson Glueck's work in the 1950's? He discovered a 150 mile stretch of the Exodus route in the late 50's. From Kadesh-barnea to Hormath, east of Beersheba. Nomadic peoples seldom leave much behind. Glueck is a Bible trasher who takes the view that the Exodus happened after 1200 BC, when the Bible says it happened in 1450 BC http://www.bible.ca/archeology/bible-archeology-exodus-kadesh-barnea-civilization-of-the-edomites-nelson-glueck-1947ad.htm Gluek's work isn't about the exodus. It's about the existing locals. Gluek, a rabbi, re-dates the exodus based on populations mentioned in the bible who did not exist until after 1200BC. I have been unable to find any archeological evidence discovered by Gluek that is related to the route taken on the exodus. I made a date error. The iron age does not start to the 12th century BC, in Iran so there was no need for "Moses" to make charcoal in the biblical date of 1450BC as Moses did not have "Iron". Sorry for my error. Do you believe the exodus was 600,000 warriors and their families?
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Not just Moses can turn gold to dust...	06/17/09 12:35:45	twillight
Re: Not just Moses can turn gold to dust...	06/17/09 13:01:54	wickle
Re: Not just Moses can turn gold to dust...	06/17/09 13:37:13	twillight
Re: Not just Moses can turn gold to dust...	06/17/09 13:44:14	wickle
Re: Not just Moses can turn gold to dust...	06/17/09 16:25:08	Argy Lacedom
Re: Not just Moses can turn gold to dust...	06/17/09 16:43:52	wickle
Silver And Gold	06/19/09 10:59:42	Daystar.pathwaymachine
Daystar fails chemistry	06/19/09 11:31:01	twillight
Re: Not just Moses can turn gold to dust...	06/19/09 13:31:32	Daystar.pathwaymachine
Re: Not just Moses can turn gold to dust...	06/21/09 16:25:50	Matthew Ellard.pedg
Re: Not just Moses can turn gold to dust...	06/21/09 16:35:27	Daystar.pathwaymachine
Re: Not just Moses can turn gold to dust...	06/21/09 18:42:45	Matthew Ellard.pedg
Re: Not just Moses can turn gold to dust...	06/22/09 07:08:30	Daystar.pathwaymachine
Re: Not just Moses can turn gold to dust...	06/22/09 16:56:54	Matthew Ellard.pedg