SAB distorts and misrepresents "misquotes"

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David from Texas	SAB distorts and misrepresents "misquotes"		Lead	[-]
Posts: 2001 08/10/05 08:13:34	Tags : None The following "misquotes" claimed by the SAB are actually not misquotes. The seeming inconsistency between the NT quotes of the OT passages, and of the OT passages themselves, is explained on the basis that the KJV utilized different source texts for the OT and for the NT. The translation for the OT in the KJV is derived from the Masoretic texts which were likely compiled from 600 A.D. to 1000 A.D. The translation for the NT in the KJV comes from the Greek NT of the Textus Receptus. The NT authors quoted from the Septuagint, which was a Greek translation of the OT that was written about 250 B.C. There are subtle differences between the Masoretic texts and the Septuagint, particularly in the Messianic prophecies. These differences are being exploited by the SAB to falsely claim that the authors of the NT misquoted the OT. The so-called "misquotes" claimed by the SAB include the following: SAB claim: *Quote:* The prophecy given in Is.7:14 referred not to a virgin but to a young woman, living at the time of the prophecy. And Jesus, of course, was called Jesus -- and is not called Emmanuel in any verse in the New Testament. [Matthew] 1:23 FALSE. Compared with the Septuagint, the verse is correctly quoted by the NT author. source: www.apostlesbible.com/ SAB claim: *Quote:* The devil correctly quotes scripture (Ps.91:11-12), while Jesus misquotes Deuteronomy by adding "only" to Dt.6:13. [Matthew] 4:6, 10 FALSE. The devil purposely misquotes Psalm 91:11-12 BY LEAVING OUT IN THE MIDDLE OF THE PASSAGE the phrase "to keep you in all your ways." Compared with the Septuagint, the verse in Deuteronomy is correctly quoted by Jesus. source: www.apostlesbible.com/ SAB claim: *Quote:* Misquote of Ps.78:2-3 [Matthew] 13:35 FALSE. Compared with the Septuagint, the verse is correctly quoted by the NT author. source: www.apostlesbible.com/ SAB claim: *Quote:* Jesus says that those who believe in him will, as the scripture says, have living waters flowing out of their bellies. Well that sounds like fun, but there is no such scripture in the Bible. [John] 7:38 FALSE. Jesus is quoting Isaiah 58:11 which reads as follows in the Septuagint... "and your God shall be with you continually, and you shall be satisfied according as your soul desires; and your bones shall be made fat, and shall be as a well-watered garden, and as a fountain from which the water has not failed." source: www.apostlesbible.com/ The term for soul and belly is often interchangeable. One of the definitions of the soul (Hebrew: nephesh) is the "seat of the appetite". One of the definitions of the belly (Greek: koilia) is the "innermost part of a man, the soul, heart as the seat of thought, feeling, choice." source: www.olivetree.com/cgi-bin...hBible.htm SAB claim: *Quote:* Misquote of Is.28:16. [Romans] 9:33 FALSE. Compared with the Septuagint, the verse is correctly quoted by the NT author. source: www.apostlesbible.com/ SAB claim: *Quote:* Paul misquotes Dt.30:14, leaving off the words "that thou mayest do it" and adding "that is, the word of faith which we preach." By doing so he completely changed the meaning of quoted verse (that it is necessary to follow the Law) to support his doctrine of salvation by faith alone. [Romans] 10:8 FALSE. Compared with the Septuagint, the verse is correctly quoted by the NT author. Paul leaves out the phrase from the Septuagint "AND in thine hands to do it..." Paul simply stops quoting from the middle of the OT verse. He does not include every phrase from every verse he is quoting. Even if he had left in the ending phrase from the Septuagint, it would have not changed the meaning of his message. He is NOT changing the phrase "that thou mayest do it" which is in the Masoretic text to the phrase "that is, the word of faith, which we preach". Why? Because the Masoretic did NOT exist at the time of Paul's writing!!! The SAB is falsely accusing Paul of falsifying a quote from the OT to suit a theological stance. Such an accusation is ridiculous because the Masoretic was not even in existence during the time of Paul. An analogy to this type of false accusation would be to accuse Walt Disney of falsifying the dialogue of Speilberg's adaption of Peter Pan. source: www.apostlesbible.com/ SAB claim: *Quote:* Misquote of Jer.31:32 [Hebrews] 8:9 FALSE. Compared with the Septuagint, the verse is correctly quoted by the NT author. source: www.apostlesbible.com/ SAB claim: *Quote:* Misquote of Ps.40:6 [Hebrews] 10:5-6 FALSE. Compared with the Septuagint, the verse is correctly quoted by the NT author. source: www.apostlesbible.com/ Dear SAB, Will you be honest in dealing with the above by retracting your claims of these so-called "misquotes"? Or will you continue to hide the truth and mislead your readers into the false impression that the NT authors misqoted the OT?
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ety3	SAB's been busy lately. I don't know when she'll respond.	#1	[url]	[-]
Posts: 7038 08/10/05 08:25:41
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David from Texas	Re: SAB's been busy lately. I don't know when she'll respon	#2	[url]	[-]
Posts: 2001 08/10/05 08:31:23	Busy lately? Yeah right... Did you notice that it took less than a minute for SAB to move this thread off of the general page? If SAB is paying that much attention to the general page and quickly moves this off the page, then he/she certainly has the time to respond. Let's see just how quickly anyone responds on this one...
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cyborg	Re: SAB's been busy lately. I don't know when she'll respon	#3	[url]	[-]
Posts: 1918 08/10/05 08:35:40	*Quote:* Did you notice that it took less than a minute for SAB to move this thread off of the general page If ety3's not paying attention to the threads he's moving I'd be worried about his mental faculties.
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David from Texas	Re: SAB's been busy lately. I don't know when she'll respon	#4	[url]	[-]
Posts: 2001 08/10/05 08:38:39	*Quote:* Re: SAB's been busy lately. I don't know when she'll respon cyborg Quote: Did you notice that it took less than a minute for SAB to move this thread off of the general page If ety3's not paying attention to the threads he's moving I'd be worried about his mental faculties. Well, whoever is moving the threads... it does not matter. If ety3 is moving them, then why not respond to the post?
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cyborg	Re: SAB's been busy lately. I don't know when she'll respon	#5	[url]	[-]
Posts: 1918 08/10/05 08:42:50	*Quote:* If ety3 is moving them, then why not respond to the post? Does he have to? I don't recall it being an integral part of the moderator's function that in addition to ensuring the smooth running of the forum and the correct placement of threads that he also has the obligation to respond to each and every thread made. You're fast heading towards the "forum conspiracist Christian" catergory here.
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Malkut	Re: SAB's been busy lately. I don't know when she'll respon	#6	[url]	[-]
Posts: 7243 08/10/05 08:43:12	*Quote:* If ety3 is moving them, then why not respond to the post? Because he has better things to do right this very second then run through the SAB and check each one of your claims, and nobody here is obliged to respond to every post right away? Often a non-Christian knows something about the earth, the heavens, and the other parts of the world, about the motions and orbits of the stars and even their sizes and distances, . . . and this knowledge he holds with certainty from reason and experience. It is thus offensive and disgraceful for an unbeliever to hear a Christian talk nonsense about such things, claiming that what he is saying is based in Scripture. We should do all that we can to avoid such an embarrassing situation, lest the unbeliever see only ignorance in the Christian and laugh to scorn." - St. Augustine, "De Genesi ad litteram libri duodecim" quote, criticize quote, criticize What kind of malevolent disease are you? -One of Dickweed Zero's Alternate Personalities
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David from Texas	Re: SAB's been busy lately. I don't know when she'll respon	#7	[url]	[-]
Posts: 2001 08/10/05 08:46:46	*Quote:* Re: SAB's been busy lately. I don't know when she'll respon Malkut Quote: If ety3 is moving them, then why not respond to the post? Because he has better things to do right this very second then run through the SAB and check each one of your claims, and nobody here is obliged to respond to every post right away? fair enough... I am curious what your response and the responses of the others will be to this post.
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Malkut	Re: SAB's been busy lately. I don't know when she'll respon	#8	[url]	[-]
Posts: 7243 08/10/05 08:54:12	*Quote:* I am curious what your response and the responses of the others will be to this post My current response is that I had to be at work at four thirty this morning, so I could give a rat's ass if your Old Testymint agrees with your spathula. Or whatever. That's the kind of thing you take up with Steve or one of the others who are good at this sort of thing, not me. Often a non-Christian knows something about the earth, the heavens, and the other parts of the world, about the motions and orbits of the stars and even their sizes and distances, . . . and this knowledge he holds with certainty from reason and experience. It is thus offensive and disgraceful for an unbeliever to hear a Christian talk nonsense about such things, claiming that what he is saying is based in Scripture. We should do all that we can to avoid such an embarrassing situation, lest the unbeliever see only ignorance in the Christian and laugh to scorn." - St. Augustine, "De Genesi ad litteram libri duodecim" quote, criticize quote, criticize What kind of malevolent disease are you? -One of Dickweed Zero's Alternate Personalities
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Quontir	Re: SAB distorts and misrepresents "misquotes"	#9	[url]	[-]
Posts: 725 08/10/05 09:15:11	I tell you what you provide evidence that the Septuagint is the one and only official translation that everyone should use and then I'll debate these points until then the points stand as they are and are correct because a reading of the KJV shows clearly that all of these are misquotes. You want to bring some other text in it still does not prove anything because in the KJ version these are indeed misquotes. Got a problem with that take it up with King James.....
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David from Texas	Re: SAB's been busy lately. I don't know when she'll respon	#10	[url]	[-]
Posts: 2001 08/10/05 09:16:35	*Quote:* Re: SAB's been busy lately. I don't know when she'll respon Malkut Quote: I am curious what your response and the responses of the others will be to this post My current response is that I had to be at work at four thirty this morning, so I could give a rat's a** if your Old Testymint agrees with your spathula. Or whatever. That's the kind of thing you take up with Steve or one of the others who are good at this sort of thing, not me. I am here to tell you that "Steve or one of the others" are NOT good at this sort of thing. They are hiding the truth and are deliberately misrepresenting these so-called "misquotes" as being valid. I am challenging them to retract them because there is absolutely no valid argument for them whatsoever. Are you going to let people like "Steve or one of the others" define for you what is true? If you buy the false claims that are portrayed on this site, then what else will you be deceived by? Are you going to be responsible and check out what is being claimed, or will you continue to bury your head in the sand and make smart-alec remarks?
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cyborg	Re: SAB's been busy lately. I don't know when she'll respon	#11	[url]	[-]
Posts: 1918 08/10/05 09:21:08	*Quote:* I am challenging them to retract them because there is absolutely no valid argument for them whatsoever. Right... so you're asking them to retract these statements based on your argument that a book you cannot produce infact corrects these problems. You might as well ask them to retract because the Holy Spirit told you the answer to these problems - which you probably have: I can't remember.
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Badsidhe	Hypocricy	#12	[url]	[-]
Posts: 3190 08/10/05 09:48:59	*Quote:* Are you going to be responsible and check out what is being claimed, or will you continue to bury your head in the sand and make smart-alec remarks? Let's be fair, DfT. It would be impossible for us to check out your claims, as you have already stated that you have no access and have never seen this book you are getting your information from. You have stated that these books are not available for viewing. How do you expect us to check claims against an unavailable source? Further, why are you asking anybody here to be "responsible" and "check out what is being claimed"? Whenever I try to be responsible and check out your claims, you always respond with "it is mysterious", or "I never really thought about it", or "that's just what I believe". When further pressed about your claims, you admit that you have no reasonable, logical arguments to present in support of your claims. How about this for an idea: find some reasonable, logical arguments to support your claims before you demand that somebody else be responsible and check out another person's claims that you disagree with. Patch up the holes in your own roof before whining about possible leaks in your neighbor's.
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Malkut	Re: SAB's been busy lately. I don't know when she'll respon	#13	[url]	[-]
Posts: 7243 08/10/05 10:00:49	*Quote:* I am challenging them to retract them because there is absolutely no valid argument for them whatsoever. Coming from a person who's admitted and embraced the fact that his beliefs and ideas are illogical and faulty, that's really, really funny. Tell us again how there most certainly are contradictions in the KJV, and then, in the same breath, call them supposed contradictions. Because, when you use semantics like that, it really convinces me. *Quote:* Are you going to let people like "Steve or one of the others" define for you what is true? I found the SAB after I started disbelieving. I didn't even check the quotes you picked out the first time I read the Bible. I don't care if some obscure quote is wrong in something that is referred to by a technical term that sounds like a gynecologist's instrument. I disbelieve because the Bible is a massive contradiction, celebrating slavery, rape, slaughter, and inhumanity, while embracing love, peace, and charity. It was written by people who never knew of or considered things like legitimate historical accuracy or modern science, yet that is the standard it is held to by both its believers and detractors. I disbelieve because Christian theology, for all it's pompousness and self-righteousness, is about as deep as a teaspoon. I disbelieve because nobody's ever been able to demonstrate to me that a god exists, that it cares rather or not I know that, that it's their god, or even rather or not any of those questions even matter. I disbelieve because any crazy person can take any set of beliefs, find a bunch of verses that seem to support them, and call it biblical, as if the Bible we a vast tabula rasa for nutcases. I disbelieve because I look at the vastness and majesty of the cosmos and cant see it all existing so some cosmic sky daddy figure can pass out treats to the good little girls and boys, and eternal spankings to the bad ones. I guess I should just toss all that aside because Steve might have got some quotes wrong. I should stop listening to him, and start listening to a True Christian, like David from Texas. . . . Often a non-Christian knows something about the earth, the heavens, and the other parts of the world, about the motions and orbits of the stars and even their sizes and distances, . . . and this knowledge he holds with certainty from reason and experience. It is thus offensive and disgraceful for an unbeliever to hear a Christian talk nonsense about such things, claiming that what he is saying is based in Scripture. We should do all that we can to avoid such an embarrassing situation, lest the unbeliever see only ignorance in the Christian and laugh to scorn." - St. Augustine, "De Genesi ad litteram libri duodecim" quote, criticize quote, criticize What kind of malevolent disease are you? -One of Dickweed Zero's Alternate Personalities
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David from Texas	Re: SAB distorts and misrepresents "misquotes"	#14	[url]	[-]
Posts: 2001 08/10/05 10:32:00	*Quote:* Re: SAB distorts and misrepresents "misquotes" Quontir I tell you what you provide evidence that the Septuagint is the one and only official translation that everyone should use and then I'll debate these points until then the points stand as they are and are correct because a reading of the KJV shows clearly that all of these are misquotes. The Septuagint is often referred to as LXX... or seventy. The reason for this lies in the history in how it was written. Seventy elders from Israel were brought to Alexandria Egypt in the 3rd century BC to translate the Hebrew Text of the Bible (the Old Testament) into Greek. There are many reasons why this was done, the primary reason was that Jews all over the world were in need of finally having a translation of their sacred scriptures in a language they understood. Many Jews by that time had become Hellenized (spoke Greek). The following is from Wikipedia: *Quote:* Modern scholarship holds that the LXX was translated and composed over the course of the 3rd through 1st centuries BC(E), beginning with the Torah. The oldest witnesses to the LXX include 2nd century BC fragments of Leviticus and Deuteronomy (Rahlfs nos. 801, 819, and 957), and 1st century BC fragments of Genesis, Exodus, Leviticus, Numbers, Deuteronomy, and the Minor Prophets (Rahlfs nos. 802, 803, 805, 848, 942, and 943). Relatively complete manuscripts of the LXX include the Codex Vaticanus and the Codex Sinaiticus of the 4th century AD/CE and the Codex Alexandrinus of the 5th century. These are indeed the oldest surviving nearly-complete manuscripts of the Old Testament in any language; the oldest extant complete Hebrew texts date from around 1000. Some scholars, comparing existing copies of the Septuagint, Masoretic text, the Samaritan text, and the Dead Sea scrolls, suggest that the Septuagint was not translated directly from what is today the Masoretic Text, but rather from an earlier Hebrew text that is now lost. However, other scholars suggest that the Septuagint itself changed for various reasons, including scribal errors, efforts at exegesis, and attempts to support theological positions, a charge that could equally be made against the Masoretic text. Accordingly, the Septuagint went through a number of revisions and recensions, the most famous of which include those by Aquila (AD 12 , a student of Rabbi Akiva; and Origen (235), a Christian theologian in Alexandria. These issues notwithstanding, the text of the LXX is usually very close to that of the Masoretic. The KJV translators went with the Masoretic. Since the Masoretic and the Septuagint differ in some important respects, then it is obvious that there would be conflicts between the Masoretic and the NT quotes of the Septuagint. The bottom line is that these so-called misquotes are NOT misquotes, but instead are a reflection of the differences between the Masoretic and the Septuagint. *Quote:* You want to bring some other text in it still does not prove anything because in the KJ version these are indeed misquotes. Got a problem with that take it up with King James..... ??? How can they be misquotes if the NT authors quoted from the Septuagint? Your statement is analagous to saying that the Japanese surrender aboard the ship Missouri was invalid because the New York Times "misquoted" the Japanese foreign minister as saying "we officially surrendered aboard the USS Misouli".
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David from Texas	Re: Hypocricy	#15	[url]	[-]
Posts: 2001 08/10/05 10:56:18	*Quote:* Hypocricy Badsidhe Quote: Are you going to be responsible and check out what is being claimed, or will you continue to bury your head in the sand and make smart-alec remarks? Let's be fair, DfT. It would be impossible for us to check out your claims, as you have already stated that you have no access and have never seen this book you are getting your information from. You have stated that these books are not available for viewing. How do you expect us to check claims against an unavailable source? Yeah, let's be fair... Why not go to that repository of truth, Wikipedia... en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Septuagint The books ARE available for viewing. There are many ancient manuscriptus of the Septuagint that have withstood the test of time. The earliest manuscripts extant of the Septuagint predate the extant Masoretic by about 1100 years. So, Badshide, are you going to continue to accept the falsehoods displayed on this site, or are you finally going to demonstrate some integrity by challenging some of these so-called misqotes as being valid? NOT ONE person who has responded to this post has the integrity to see these so-called "misquotes" for what they are... Are ALL of you going to implicate yourself in continuing to side with the lies? *Quote:* Further, why are you asking anybody here to be "responsible" and "check out what is being claimed"? Whenever I try to be responsible and check out your claims, you always respond with "it is mysterious", or "I never really thought about it", or "that's just what I believe". The above is hyperbole and outright false. I do not "always respond with 'it is mysterious', or 'I never really thought about it'. If I do not have an answer, then I may respond with such phrases... But to say that I always respond in that manner is an absurd thing for even you to say, Badsidhe. *Quote:* How about this for an idea: find some reasonable, logical arguments to support your claims before you demand that somebody else be responsible and check out another person's claims that you disagree with. How about this for an idea... Why don't you actually check out what I have claimed first, before disagreeing with it? Show us how the arguments that I have made about these so-called "misquotes" are not logical.
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Malkut	Re: Hypocricy	#16	[url]	[-]
Posts: 7243 08/10/05 11:08:26	So, the Septuagint is "the inerrant word of God"? If someone found an error in the Septuagint, would you then accept that the Bible is in error, and is therefore not the Word of God? Often a non-Christian knows something about the earth, the heavens, and the other parts of the world, about the motions and orbits of the stars and even their sizes and distances, . . . and this knowledge he holds with certainty from reason and experience. It is thus offensive and disgraceful for an unbeliever to hear a Christian talk nonsense about such things, claiming that what he is saying is based in Scripture. We should do all that we can to avoid such an embarrassing situation, lest the unbeliever see only ignorance in the Christian and laugh to scorn." - St. Augustine, "De Genesi ad litteram libri duodecim" quote, criticize quote, criticize What kind of malevolent disease are you? -One of Dickweed Zero's Alternate Personalities
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Badsidhe	Re: Hypocricy	#17	[url]	[-]
Posts: 3190 08/10/05 11:25:09	*Quote:* The books ARE available for viewing. Earlier you told us that the original inerrant manuscripts are not available. Are you now telling us that they are available, or are you telling us that these books that ARE available are errant, but are not the originals? *Quote:* So, Badshide, are you going to continue to accept the falsehoods displayed on this site, I've already stated that I have never read the Bible (past the naming of Israel), and that I do not really care about contradictions/conflicts with science, etc. I don't accept, nor do I have a need to accept, anything stated on this site as factual. *Quote:* Badsidhe: Further, why are you asking anybody here to be "responsible" and "check out what is being claimed"? Whenever I try to be responsible and check out your claims, you always respond with "it is mysterious", or "I never really thought about it", or "that's just what I believe". ------------------------------ DfT: The above is hyperbole and outright false. You're right. I left out "I can't answer blasphemy", or simply ignoring the questions being asked. It is true that to some individual questions, you answered differently. However, when I asked for the reasoning behind those answers you provided, you then supplied the standard lines of "it is mysterious", etc. In other words, at the end of every conversation following any line of reasoning you provided, it always ended with "it is mysterious", "I never really thought about it", "that's just what I believe", "I won't answer blasphemous questions", or silence. So I thank you for offering the opportunity to correct my statement. You did not answer every question as above. You did, however, end every line of inquiry as outlined above. *Quote:* How about this for an idea... Why don't you actually check out what I have claimed first, before disagreeing with it? I'm trying to check your claims as best I can. It is hard to check up on "it is mysterious", "I never really thought about it", "that's just what I believe", "I won't answer blasphemous questions", and silence. Making my task even more difficult is your admission that you have no reasonable, logical arguments to support your claims. *Quote:* Show us how the arguments that I have made about these so-called "misquotes" are not logical. I don't even have command of English yet, let alone ancient languages. I have no ability to argue this subject as you present it, beyond appealing to authority. I would rather you present a reasonable, logical case for believing in your mythology. Maybe then I'll take an interest in learning old languages.
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David from Texas	Re: SAB's been busy lately. I don't know when she'll respon	#18	[url]	[-]
Posts: 2001 08/10/05 11:25:10	*Quote:* I am challenging them to retract them because there is absolutely no valid argument for them whatsoever. Coming from a person who's admitted and embraced the fact that his beliefs and ideas are illogical and faulty, that's really, really funny. Tell us again how there most certainly are contradictions in the KJV, and then, in the same breath, call them supposed contradictions. Because, when you use semantics like that, it really convinces me. The key word is "apparent". There are most certaintly "apparent" contradictions in the KJV. Under close examination, these so-called contradictions are found to be only a reflection in the differences in the source texts used for translation. The original texts were not contradictory. The KJV is not the original. When the history is understood for how the KJV was translated, then the "apparent" contradicitons are no longer true contradictions. *Quote:* Are you going to let people like "Steve or one of the others" define for you what is true? I found the SAB after I started disbelieving. I didn't even check the quotes you picked out the first time I read the Bible. I don't care if some obscure quote is wrong in something that is referred to by a technical term that sounds like a gynecologist's instrument. Yes, the quotes are "obscure" to the casual observer, but the apparent underlying problem with them reveals a much larger pattern of misrepresentation and falsehood. If you accept as valid these appararent "misquotes", then what else are you so blindly accepting that is clearly false? You need to ask yourself that question. If you cannot bring yourself to challenge these simple misrepresentations, then how can you be so sure that you are not believing much bigger lies? *Quote:* I disbelieve because the Bible is a massive contradiction, celebrating slavery, rape, slaughter, and inhumanity, while embracing love, peace, and charity You have been deceived into believing the above. SAB has lied to you about the "misquotes", should not that make you wonder if the other claims made here are also lies? *Quote:* It was written by people who never knew of or considered things like legitimate historical accuracy or modern science, yet that is the standard it is held to by both its believers and detractors. The modern science issue is easy... the writers lived long before modern science, therefore, we should not hold them to the same standard (even with the Bible being the Word of God, it was written for ALL generations subsequent to it, not just for ours). In regard to legitimate historical accuracy, the Bible time and time again is found to have historical accuracy with each new archeologic discovery pertaining to events claimed in the Bible. *Quote:* I disbelieve because Christian theology, for all it's pompousness and self-righteousness, is about as deep as a teaspoon. I disbelieve because nobody's ever been able to demonstrate to me that a god exists, that it cares rather or not I know that, that it's their god, or even rather or not any of those questions even matter. I agree with you that nobody is able to demonstrate such things to you to the point that it would convince you. I believe that faith is a gift of God, not a work of man. However, I can show you how the others are lying to you. I can also give a defense of the hope that is within me. *Quote:* I disbelieve because any crazy person can take any set of beliefs, find a bunch of verses that seem to support them, and call it biblical, as if the Bible we a vast tabula rasa for nutcases. Agree. But if the Holy Spirit guides you into all truth, then it becomes clear to you who is misintepreting the Bible. *Quote:* I disbelieve because I look at the vastness and majesty of the cosmos and cant see it all existing so some cosmic sky daddy figure can pass out treats to the good little girls and boys, and eternal spankings to the bad ones. Who is to say that God created the universe only for mankind? He also created it for angelic beings. There may be many other worlds like our own that He has not revealed to us yet... *Quote:* I guess I should just toss all that aside because Steve might have got some quotes wrong. If it was only a matter of some mistakes done in good faith, then I would agree with your argument. However, these so-called "misquotes" are deliberate misrepresentations. I am challenging Steve and the SAB to remove them.
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Iznomneak	Re: SAB distorts and misrepresents "misquotes"	#19	[url]	[-]
Posts: 3079 08/10/05 11:33:50	*Quote:* SAB: Misquote of Ps.78:2-3 [Matthew] 13:35 David: FALSE. Compared with the Septuagint, the verse is correctly quoted by the NT author. source: www.apostlesbible.com/ Your argument would be much more compelling if you copy/pasted the quotes in question (with links) instead of merely contradicting the SAB and forcing the reader to do your homework for you. Also, it might be more effective to create a new thread for each specific quote in question. So let's look at this one case here: skepticsannotatedbible.com/mt/13.html *Quote:* KJV Matthew 13:35 That it might be fulfilled which was spoken by the prophet, saying, I will open my mouth in parables; I will utter things which have been kept secret from the foundation of the world. Blue Letter Bible Greek: www.blueletterbible.org/cgi-bin/c.pl?book=Mat&chapter=13&verse=35&version=kjv (The English is the same as above, but the Greek words can be referenced) skepticsannotatedbible.com/ps/78.html *Quote:* KJV Psalms 78:2 I will open my mouth in a parable I will utter dark sayings of old 78:3 Which we have heard and known, and our fathers have told us. OK, so the KJV Matthew is clearly misquoting KJV Psalms. www.apostlesbible.com/books/p19psalms/p19c78.htm *Quote:* Septuagint: PSALM 78 2 I will open my mouth in parables; I will utter dark sayings which have been from the beginning. 3 All which we have heard and known, and our fathers have declared to us. The Septuagint Psalms actually looks closer to the KJV Psalms than the KJV Matthew quote does. The differences being: "A parable" (KJV Psalms) vs "In parables" (Sept Psalms, KJV Matthew) "I will utter things which have been kept secret from the foundation of the world." (KJV Matthew) vs "I will utter dark sayings of old" (KJV Psalms) vs "I will utter dark sayings which have been from the beginning." (Sept Psalms) Even with the Septuagint, it still looks like KJV Matthew's claim "which was spoken by the prophet, saying," is misquoted. You will have to do the homework on the rest of your claims. Please avoid retorts such as "you are blind" and other ad homs in your response and present your case with facts. with Science Fiction, all things are possible
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Iznomneak	Re: SAB distorts and misrepresents "misquotes"	#20	[url]	[-]
Posts: 3079 08/10/05 11:42:02	LOL, Ezboard chokes on my post and won't let me edit it to remove the frowns (I didn't intentionally put them there). with Science Fiction, all things are possible
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SAB distorts and misrepresents "misquotes"	08/10/05 08:13:34	David from Texas
SAB's been busy lately. I don't know when she'll respond.	08/10/05 08:25:41	ety3
Re: SAB's been busy lately. I don't know when she'll respon	08/10/05 08:31:23	David from Texas
Re: SAB's been busy lately. I don't know when she'll respon	08/10/05 08:35:40	cyborg
Re: SAB's been busy lately. I don't know when she'll respon	08/10/05 08:38:39	David from Texas
Re: SAB's been busy lately. I don't know when she'll respon	08/10/05 08:42:50	cyborg
Re: SAB's been busy lately. I don't know when she'll respon	08/10/05 08:43:12	Malkut
Re: SAB's been busy lately. I don't know when she'll respon	08/10/05 08:46:46	David from Texas
Re: SAB's been busy lately. I don't know when she'll respon	08/10/05 08:54:12	Malkut
Re: SAB's been busy lately. I don't know when she'll respon	08/10/05 09:16:35	David from Texas
Re: SAB's been busy lately. I don't know when she'll respon	08/10/05 09:21:08	cyborg
Hypocricy	08/10/05 09:48:59	Badsidhe
Re: Hypocricy	08/10/05 10:56:18	David from Texas
Re: Hypocricy	08/10/05 11:08:26	Malkut
Re: Hypocricy	08/10/05 12:01:21	David from Texas
Re: Hypocricy	08/10/05 11:25:09	Badsidhe
Re: Hypocricy	08/10/05 12:04:20	jeff
Re: Hypocricy	08/10/05 15:21:05	David from Texas
Re: Hypocricy	08/10/05 17:04:21	jeff
Re: Hypocricy	08/10/05 19:51:28	David from Texas
Re: Hypocricy	08/10/05 20:51:04	jeff
Re: Hypocricy	08/10/05 21:37:49	David from Texas
Re: Hypocricy	08/11/05 01:44:10	jeff
Re: Hypocricy	08/11/05 11:16:06	David from Texas
Re: Hypocricy	08/11/05 12:20:28	jeff
Re: Hypocricy	08/10/05 23:40:31	FreeFromChristianity
Re: Hypocricy	08/11/05 11:19:10	David from Texas
Re: SAB's been busy lately. I don't know when she'll respon	08/10/05 10:00:49	Malkut
Re: SAB's been busy lately. I don't know when she'll respon	08/10/05 11:25:10	David from Texas
Re: SAB's been busy lately. I don't know when she'll respon	08/10/05 12:13:40	Malkut
Re: SAB's been busy lately. I don't know when she'll respon	08/10/05 13:34:08	David from Texas
Re: SAB's been busy lately. I don't know when she'll respon	08/10/05 17:20:40	Malkut
Re: SAB's been busy lately. I don't know when she'll respon	08/25/05 07:26:05	Saeng
Re: SAB's been busy lately. I don't know when she'll respon	08/25/05 14:12:24	Saeng
Re: SAB distorts and misrepresents "misquotes"	08/10/05 09:15:11	Quontir
Re: SAB distorts and misrepresents "misquotes"	08/10/05 10:32:00	David from Texas
Re: SAB distorts and misrepresents "misquotes"	08/10/05 11:46:35	Quontir
Re: SAB distorts and misrepresents "misquotes"	08/10/05 12:50:35	David from Texas
Re: SAB distorts and misrepresents "misquotes"	08/10/05 14:05:35	FreeFromChristianity
Re: SAB distorts and misrepresents "misquotes"	08/10/05 14:10:38	David from Texas
Re: David distorts and misrepresents "others"	08/10/05 16:27:36	Debbie TT
Re: David distorts and misrepresents "others"	08/10/05 16:38:49	David from Texas
Re: David distorts and misrepresents "others"	08/10/05 16:52:20	FreeFromChristianity
Re: David distorts and misrepresents "others"	08/10/05 17:41:41	David from Texas
Re: David distorts and misrepresents "others"	08/10/05 17:48:24	Unregistered(d)
Re: David distorts and misrepresents "others"	08/10/05 17:55:10	David from Texas
Re: SAB distorts and misrepresents "misquotes"	08/11/05 05:33:40	Quontir
Translations	08/11/05 05:59:00	cyborg
Re: SAB distorts and misrepresents "misquotes"	08/11/05 12:35:03	David from Texas
Re: SAB distorts and misrepresents "misquotes"	08/12/05 05:51:12	Quontir
Re: SAB distorts and misrepresents "misquotes"	08/12/05 07:50:02	David from Texas
Re: SAB distorts and misrepresents "misquotes"	08/12/05 10:38:30	Quontir
Re: SAB distorts and misrepresents "misquotes"	08/12/05 12:07:22	David from Texas
god allows errors	08/14/05 20:29:23	Tanstaafl
Re: SAB distorts and misrepresents "misquotes"	08/15/05 03:58:32	cyborg
Re: SAB distorts and misrepresents "misquotes"	08/15/05 09:36:11	Quontir
Re: SAB distorts and misrepresents "misquotes"	08/15/05 16:28:32	David from Texas
Re: SAB distorts and misrepresents "misquotes"	08/16/05 04:59:53	Quontir
Re: SAB distorts and misrepresents "misquotes"	08/16/05 13:49:51	David from Texas
Re: SAB distorts and misrepresents "misquotes"	08/17/05 10:09:04	Quontir
Re: SAB distorts and misrepresents "misquotes"	08/16/05 07:53:23	One Brow
Re: SAB distorts and misrepresents "misquotes"	08/16/05 14:59:21	David from Texas
Re: SAB distorts and misrepresents "misquotes"	08/17/05 12:40:08	One Brow
Spreading misinformation	08/10/05 13:49:03	Badsidhe
Re: Spreading misinformation	08/10/05 14:07:13	David from Texas
Re: Spreading misinformation	08/10/05 14:52:51	Badsidhe
Re: Spreading misinformation	08/10/05 15:50:54	David from Texas
Re: Spreading misinformation	08/10/05 20:00:24	Badsidhe
Re: Spreading misinformation	08/10/05 20:46:38	David from Texas
Re: Spreading misinformation	08/11/05 01:41:07	cyborg
Re: Spreading misinformation	08/11/05 14:49:53	Iznomneak
Re: Spreading misinformation	08/11/05 20:27:12	David from Texas
Re: Spreading misinformation	08/12/05 06:35:06	Badsidhe
Re: SAB distorts and misrepresents "misquotes"	08/10/05 11:33:50	Iznomneak
Re: SAB distorts and misrepresents "misquotes"	08/10/05 11:42:02	Iznomneak
Re: SAB distorts and misrepresents "misquotes"	08/10/05 12:16:52	Malkut
Re: SAB distorts and misrepresents "misquotes"	08/10/05 12:27:37	Iznomneak
fixing bad & naughty html	08/10/05 22:06:12	Tanstaafl
Re: fixing bad & naughty html	08/11/05 05:24:49	Iznomneak
David, are you going to go to kansas?	08/11/05 06:01:46	Keith and Company
Re: David, are you going to go to kansas?	08/11/05 13:00:40	David from Texas
Re: David, are you going to go to kansas?	08/11/05 17:40:43	Keith and Company
Re: David, are you going to go to kansas?	08/11/05 20:23:04	David from Texas
Re: David, are you going to go to kansas?	08/12/05 04:50:37	Keith and Company
Re: David, are you going to go to kansas?	08/12/05 06:25:08	David from Texas
Re: David, are you going to go to kansas?	08/12/05 07:06:40	Keith and Company
Re: David, are you going to go to kansas?	08/12/05 07:44:39	cyborg
Re: David, are you going to go to kansas?	08/12/05 08:58:00	David from Texas
Re: David, are you going to go to kansas?	08/12/05 09:24:26	Keith and Company
Re: David, are you going to go to kansas?	08/12/05 09:52:37	David from Texas
Re: David, are you going to go to kansas?	08/12/05 10:12:37	Keith and Company
More hypocricy:	08/12/05 09:31:05	Badsidhe
Re: More hypocricy:	08/12/05 10:04:39	David from Texas
Please indicate to me you are reading my posts.	08/12/05 11:13:05	Badsidhe
Re: Please indicate to me you are reading my posts.	08/12/05 12:45:00	David from Texas
Re: Please indicate to me you are reading my posts.	08/12/05 13:35:12	Badsidhe
Re: Please indicate to me you are reading my posts.	08/12/05 13:43:05	MikeyV
Posts post BMMW	08/13/05 15:41:12	Badsidhe
Re: Posts post BMMW	08/16/05 05:59:04	Keith and Company
Re: Please indicate to me you are reading my posts.	08/12/05 14:33:23	David from Texas
cutting off noses to spite faces.	08/12/05 15:15:00	jeff
cutting off noses to spite faces.	08/12/05 20:20:48	David from Texas
blow me down	08/12/05 21:20:38	jeff
Reading comprehension problem or willful ignorance?	08/13/05 15:39:51	Badsidhe
Re: Reading comprehension problem or willful ignorance?	08/13/05 16:54:24	David from Texas
Re: SAB distorts and misrepresents "misquotes"	08/18/05 00:31:21	FastHack
Re: SAB distorts and misrepresents "misquotes"	08/24/05 18:03:23	Saeng
Re: SAB distorts and misrepresents "misquotes"	08/24/05 18:33:54	Keith and Company
Re: SAB distorts and misrepresents "misquotes"	08/24/05 18:42:56	Argy Lacedom
Re: SAB distorts and misrepresents "misquotes"	08/25/05 06:03:16	Saeng
Re: SAB distorts and misrepresents "misquotes"	08/25/05 06:42:30	cyborg
Re: SAB distorts and misrepresents "misquotes"	08/25/05 07:00:35	Saeng
Re: SAB distorts and misrepresents "misquotes"	08/25/05 07:09:01	cyborg
Re: SAB distorts and misrepresents "misquotes"	08/25/05 06:26:19	One Brow
Re: SAB distorts and misrepresents "misquotes"	08/25/05 06:47:46	Saeng
Re: SAB distorts and misrepresents "misquotes"	08/25/05 07:03:05	cyborg
Re: SAB distorts and misrepresents "misquotes"	08/25/05 07:31:55	Saeng
Re: SAB distorts and misrepresents "misquotes"	08/25/05 07:21:26	One Brow
Re: Some just like to argue.	08/25/05 09:34:01	Keith and Company
Re: Some just like to argue.	08/25/05 09:39:29	Saeng
Re: Some just like to argue.	08/25/05 09:45:17	One Brow
Re: Some just like to argue.	08/25/05 10:16:31	Keith and Company
Re: Some just like to argue.	08/25/05 10:24:13	One Brow
Re: Some just like to argue.	08/25/05 10:28:17	Keith and Company
Re: Some just like to argue.	08/25/05 10:31:19	One Brow
Re: SAB distorts and misrepresents "misquotes"	08/25/05 10:11:16	Saeng
History 101	08/25/05 10:44:41	Steve Wells
Re: History 101	08/25/05 12:22:24	Saeng
Re: History 101	08/25/05 13:39:07	jeff
Re: History 101	08/25/05 14:22:03	Saeng
Re: History 101	08/25/05 14:45:35	jeff
Re: History 101	08/25/05 14:53:10	Saeng
Re: History 101	08/25/05 15:12:17	jeff
Misquotes probably DO equal mistranslations	10/21/05 08:19:02	gystex
Re: Misquotes probably DO equal mistranslations	10/21/05 10:59:32	Yark Hutprancer
Re: SAB distorts and misrepresents "misquotes"	10/21/05 12:43:55	gystex
Re: SAB distorts and misrepresents "misquotes"	10/21/05 12:46:12	Yark Hutprancer
Re: SAB distorts and misrepresents "misquotes"	10/21/05 15:10:52	gystex
Re: SAB distorts and misrepresents "misquotes"	10/21/05 16:56:57	Yark Hutprancer

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